小麥?zhǔn)裁磿r(shí)候傳播到古代中國并開始廣泛傳播？
When wheat arrived and became widespread in premodern China?
譯文簡介
historum網(wǎng)友：我們都知道小麥?zhǔn)侵袊狈缴a(chǎn)的主要農(nóng)作物。小麥產(chǎn)品在中國北方菜肴中無處不在，它是主要北方人的主食，但在過去卻不是這樣。
正文翻譯
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網(wǎng) http://www.ltaaa.com 翻譯：周天寰宇2 轉(zhuǎn)載請(qǐng)注明出處
When wheat arrived and became widespread inpremodern China?
小麥?zhǔn)裁磿r(shí)候傳播到古代中國并開始廣泛傳播？
小麥?zhǔn)裁磿r(shí)候傳播到古代中國并開始廣泛傳播？
評(píng)論翻譯
很贊 ( 9 )
收藏
We all know that wheat is the main cropproduced in Northern China and wheat products have an ubiquitous presence inNorthern Chinese dishes and it forms the main staple, but it was not like thisin the past.
我們都知道小麥?zhǔn)侵袊狈缴a(chǎn)的主要農(nóng)作物。小麥產(chǎn)品在中國北方菜肴中無處不在，它是主要北方人的主食，但在過去卻不是這樣。
By saying that, I want to know when wheatfirst arrived in China and particularly when it turned out as the main staplein Northern China.
中國文明發(fā)展早期的主要農(nóng)作物是小米，主要是“狐尾小米”。毫無疑問小麥?zhǔn)且环N中東作物，它起源在歷史上中東的某個(gè)地方。說到這里我想知道小麥?zhǔn)鞘裁磿r(shí)候第一次來到中國，特別是它在何時(shí)成為中國北方主食。
I think it depends on the area. In someplaces in the north wheat has been grown for thousands of years. I've read thatwheat farming actually predates millet in some areas. In other areas it wasintroduced later. The Sung expanded winter wheat farming further south into theYangtze delta, according to Needham.
我認(rèn)為這取決于種植面積。在北方一些地方小麥已經(jīng)種植了數(shù)千年。我讀到過某些地區(qū)小麥的種植實(shí)際上比小米早。在其他領(lǐng)域小麥則是后來被引入的。李約瑟說過宋朝官方將冬小麥種植地進(jìn)一步向南延伸到了長江三角洲。
stevapalooza said:
I think it depends on the area. In someplaces in the north wheat has been grown for thousands of years. I've read thatwheat farming actually predates millet in some areas. In other areas it wasintroduced later. The Sung expanded winter wheat farming further south into theYangtze delta, according to Needham.
But why for a long time millet was thestarch of choice in northern China if they had wheat for a millennia or so? Andhow wheat got there in the first place? Was there a migratory wave of peoplecoming from West Asia during the Neolithic period?
但是如果小麥有幾千年的歷史歷史，為什么在很長一段時(shí)間里小米是中國北方主食呢？小麥?zhǔn)侨绾蝹鞑サ侥抢锏哪?？在新石器時(shí)代是否有來自西亞的移民帶來了小麥？
我知道小麥最后才被傳播到長江下游地區(qū)，但我的問題是關(guān)于中國北方，特別是在中國華北平原（東亞文明的搖籃）。
Interesting question for India too. Thelocal grain was rice. What the Aryans knew was barley. So, wheat came frommiddle-east. The question is when?
對(duì)印度來說這也是個(gè)有趣的問題。當(dāng)?shù)赝林说闹魇呈谴竺住Ｑ爬踩说闹魇呈谴篼?。所以可以推斷小麥來自中東。問題是什么時(shí)候呢？
Aupmanyav said:
Interesting question for India too. Thelocal grain was rice. What the Aryans knew was barley. So, wheat came frommiddle-east. The question is when?
It started spreading out of FertileCrescent around 8000 BC. Reached India around 6500 BC. And very likely reachedChina during the Longshan culture
大約在公元前8000年左右小麥開始從肥沃的新月沃地蔓延開來。大約在公元前6500年被傳播到印度。很有可能在龍山文化期間被傳播到中國
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網(wǎng) http://mintwatchbillionaireclub.com 轉(zhuǎn)載請(qǐng)注明出處
Needham, again, mentions the time of thefirst arrival of wheat in China as being between 3000 BCE and 2000 BCE. It'smentioned as being grown by the Longshan culture of the Yellow river, whichexisted during that time. That might be the oldest evidence of it.
Edit: Mnsr beat me to it!
李約瑟也提到過公元前3000年到公元前2000年小麥?zhǔn)状蔚竭_(dá)中國。它被認(rèn)為是由黃河流域的龍山文化首先種植，在那個(gè)時(shí)期開始擴(kuò)散。這可能是最古老的關(guān)于小麥在中國傳播的證據(jù)。
^^^ Hahaha.. we can consider it as a drawmatch
哈哈. .我們可以把它看作打了一場(chǎng)平局
Well it must be the right answer if twodifferent people said it
如果兩個(gè)不同的人說了同一個(gè)答案，那肯定是正確答案
Two most common theories I've seen is firstthat wheat spread rapidly to Ti...an plateau from the Eurasian steppes becauseof the benefits of wheat in colder climes and was adopted more slowly fromthere as wheat processing is different and there wasn't as obvious advantagesof wheat over millet without the cooler and shorter growing season on theplateau.
我見過兩種最常見的理論可以解釋這一現(xiàn)象。首先是小麥從歐亞大草原被迅速傳播到青藏高原,因?yàn)樾←湹暮锰幵谟谒梢院涞貛Р⒗^續(xù)緩慢生長。而且或長或短的生長期對(duì)篩麥子等處理階段沒有明顯影響。
有證據(jù)表明，在中國北方粟米與小麥曾旗鼓相當(dāng)?shù)乇还餐N植幾千年。盡管小麥在大部分地區(qū)逐漸取代了小米。我認(rèn)為最早有證據(jù)能證明西藏開始種植小麥的時(shí)間大約在公元前4800年。
第二種理論是小麥從印度河流域迅速蔓延到中國沿海和內(nèi)陸河流流域，或通過海上貿(mào)易被傳播到中國。因?yàn)樵S多早期被發(fā)現(xiàn)的小麥遺跡都散布在山東等北方地區(qū)。
也許小麥通過不止一種途徑進(jìn)入中國。因?yàn)樗坪跬蝗怀霈F(xiàn)在一個(gè)大范圍的歷史記錄內(nèi)?？脊艑W(xué)家?guī)缀趺磕甓寄茉诓煌目脊磐诰虻攸c(diǎn)發(fā)現(xiàn)新的小麥遺留證據(jù)。
通過前后被發(fā)現(xiàn)的小麥遺留得出的理論是：小麥隨著舊絲綢之路或比青藏高原更北的通道被移民傳播到中國。我一直看到很多可以證明這一理論的證據(jù)，由此得出結(jié)論：小麥通過不止一條途徑進(jìn)入中國，它被當(dāng)?shù)厝朔N植后就廣受歡迎。因?yàn)樗茏罡呦薅鹊貪M足古代人的飲食需要。小麥?zhǔn)秤梦幕脖灰泼駧У礁鞯亍?/b>
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網(wǎng) http://mintwatchbillionaireclub.com 轉(zhuǎn)載請(qǐng)注明出處
That would perhaps mean that when theAryans came to India (probably 2,000-1,500 BC), Indians were familiar withwheat.
這可能意味著當(dāng)雅利安人來到印度（大概2000-1500年）時(shí)，印度人已經(jīng)對(duì)小麥很熟悉了。
chon said:
Two most common theories I've seen is firstthat wheat spread rapidly to Ti...an plateau from the Eurasian steppes becauseof the benefits of wheat in colder climes and was adopted more slowly fromthere as wheat processing is different and there wasn't as obvious advantagesof wheat over millet without the cooler and shorter growing season on theplateau.
Evidence shows millet was grownconcurrently with wheat for millenia afterwards in northern China though wheatgradually displaced millet in most area. I think the earliest evidence placeswheat in Ti... around 4,800 BCE.
The second theory is that wheat spreadrapidly from the Indus valley along coasts and rivers of southern Asia reachingChina from sea trade as many early remains of wheat are in Shandong which leapsover some area assuming only a northern route.
Probably wheat had more than one avenue ofarrival to China because it does seem to suddenly appear in a wide area in thehistorical records and archaeology is discovering new evidence of wheat nearlyevery year at various dig sites.
The old and now partially discounted theorywas that wheat arrived with migrations of peoples along the old Silk road or aslightly further north entrance than via Ti...an plateau and I've seen there isnow some more slight evidence of this as well but the main conclusion is that wheatalmost definitely entered China via more than 1 route but was adopted first andmost widely where it met the needs of the people best/and or it was newsettlers who already had wheat growing culture they brought with them.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the information you put here. Itseems there are a lot of possible explanations regarding the arrival of wheatin China (or East Asia to be exact).
But when the presence of wheat becameubiquitous in Northern China?
謝謝你提供的信息。關(guān)于小麥到達(dá)中國（確切地說是東亞）的時(shí)間似乎有很多種可能的解釋。但是什么時(shí)候小麥在中國北方變得無處不在？
robto said:
But when the presence of wheat becameubiquitous in Northern China?
That is much more difficult to answer anddepends alot on how you understand agriculture but mono crops are much morecommon now than in the past where barely and wheat were common winter crops butnot the only crops. I've read some theories that wheat wasn't widespread until400 BCE and other people who say that is far too late and most inhabitants ofnorthern China would have been familiar with wheat as a crop by 3000 BCE evenif not growing it in wide areas.
To read more-
http://www.kaogu.cn/uploads/soft/Ch...Wheatinto China –New Data and New Issues.pdf
這就更難回答了，而且很大程度上取決于你如何理解農(nóng)業(yè)?，F(xiàn)在單粒作物比過去更常見。小麥也只是普通的冬季作物，而不是唯一被種植的作物。我讀過的一些理論認(rèn)為小麥直到公元前400年才被廣泛傳播，還有一些人認(rèn)為這時(shí)間太遲了。中國北方大多數(shù)居民在公元前3000年就對(duì)小麥很熟悉，即使不是在小麥普遍被種植地區(qū)。
Thanks for the lix ;-)
感謝鏈接
Just found this another research paper onthis subject as well.
The origins of wheat in China and potentialpathways for its introduction: A review
剛剛發(fā)現(xiàn)了另一篇關(guān)于這個(gè)主題的研究論文。
回顧：中國小麥的起源以及它的引入途徑
The evidence is still sparse butsuf?cient to suggest some con-clusions. Wheatis likely to have comeinto China around the mid-6thto early 5th millennia BP. Indigenousdomestication of wheat withinChina can probably be ruled out. Introduction of wheatinto Chinafrom the south via India seems unlikely, at least as the main routeforits ?rst appearance, although its role as a secondary routecannot beruled out altogether.
證據(jù)雖然稀少，但卻可以得出一些結(jié)論。小麥可能在6世紀(jì)中期到5世紀(jì)早期進(jìn)入中國。大概可以排除中國本土種植小麥的可能性。通過印度，小麥被傳播入中國南方這一理論似乎不太可能，至少不可能作為其第一次傳播入中國的主要途徑。但它作為次要路線的角色不能完全被排除在外。
另外兩種可能的模型也已被提出，但流傳開后被人提出過一些問題。到目前為止中國最早的小麥品種是在甘肅被發(fā)現(xiàn)，這表明從南西伯利亞途徑蒙古傳入中國的可能更大，最后小麥與已有的水稻種植農(nóng)業(yè)經(jīng)濟(jì)發(fā)生碰撞。
然而史前經(jīng)濟(jì)考古數(shù)據(jù)顯示在中國以外的潛在小麥起源地區(qū)在相關(guān)時(shí)期內(nèi)幾乎沒有農(nóng)業(yè)種植方面的證據(jù)。而在6-5千年前左右的任何面包可能不是精小麥面包，而是未完全脫殼的小麥面包。
第二種模式，即“新疆途徑”。在與新疆接壤的山區(qū)西部邊緣地帶有種植的面包小麥遺存，但迄今為止在新疆境內(nèi)缺乏明確的第5譜系米蘭尼姆小麥的種植證據(jù)。然而，
隨著時(shí)間的推移，這兩種模型都會(huì)得到驗(yàn)證，更清晰的圖景也可能會(huì)被揭示。
Also notice: just because wheat wasfamiliar does not mean it was prent. For example, in Europe, the balance betweenwheat, barley and rye changed over centuries with evolution of plant varieties.
還要注意：僅僅因?yàn)槟銓?duì)小麥很熟悉并不意味著它很普遍。例如在歐洲隨著植物品種的進(jìn)化，小麥、大麥和黑麥之間的種植平衡在幾個(gè)世紀(jì)被發(fā)生過巨大變化。