歷史學(xué)家表示,一項調(diào)查顯示,英國對其過去的自豪感正在喪失,這令人鼓舞
Survey showing UK’s loss of pride in its past is encouraging, says historian譯文簡介
“古代史就是古代史。我不會為我的祖先所做的事感到把不舒服的。qnmd?!薄缎l(wèi)報》報道。
正文翻譯
Survey showing UK’s loss of pride in its past is encouraging, says historian
-Public choosing ‘Shakespeare over invasion’ and becoming more discerning about Britain’s history, says Alan Lester
歷史學(xué)家表示,一項調(diào)查顯示,英國對其過去的自豪感正在喪失,這令人鼓舞
——艾倫·萊斯特說,公眾選擇“莎士比亞而非入侵”,對英國歷史的認識也越來越敏銳
-Public choosing ‘Shakespeare over invasion’ and becoming more discerning about Britain’s history, says Alan Lester
歷史學(xué)家表示,一項調(diào)查顯示,英國對其過去的自豪感正在喪失,這令人鼓舞
——艾倫·萊斯特說,公眾選擇“莎士比亞而非入侵”,對英國歷史的認識也越來越敏銳
(A production of Shakespeare’s Henry V at the Globe theatre.)
(在環(huán)球劇院上演的莎士比亞的《亨利五世》。)
新聞:
A striking fall in pride in Britain’s history, but widespread support for the arts, shows the public are choosing “Shakespeare over invasion, exploitation and occupation”, a leading historian has said.
一位著名的歷史學(xué)家說,英國人對歷史的自豪感急劇下降,但對藝術(shù)的廣泛支持表明,公眾正在選擇“莎士比亞而不是侵略、剝削和占領(lǐng)”。
一位著名的歷史學(xué)家說,英國人對歷史的自豪感急劇下降,但對藝術(shù)的廣泛支持表明,公眾正在選擇“莎士比亞而不是侵略、剝削和占領(lǐng)”。
The findings from the British Social Attitudes survey, published this week, show that while levels of pride in Britain’s achievements in sport and the arts remained high over the past decade, there was a 22-point fall in the proportion of people saying they were proud of Britain’s history.
本周公布的英國社會態(tài)度調(diào)查結(jié)果顯示,盡管過去10年英國人對體育和藝術(shù)成就的自豪感仍然很高,但表示對英國歷史感到自豪的人的比例下降了22個百分點。
本周公布的英國社會態(tài)度調(diào)查結(jié)果顯示,盡管過去10年英國人對體育和藝術(shù)成就的自豪感仍然很高,但表示對英國歷史感到自豪的人的比例下降了22個百分點。
Prof Alan Lester, the editor of a new book on empire featuring guest essays from the eminent historian Liam J Liburd and the journalist Sathnam Sanghera, described the results as an “encouraging sign” that the public were becoming more discerning about Britain’s past.
艾倫·萊斯特教授是一本關(guān)于帝國的新書的編輯,該書收錄了著名歷史學(xué)家利亞姆·J·利伯德和記者薩特南·桑赫拉的客座文章。萊斯特將調(diào)查結(jié)果描述為一個“令人鼓舞的跡象”,表明公眾對英國的過去越來越有洞察力。
艾倫·萊斯特教授是一本關(guān)于帝國的新書的編輯,該書收錄了著名歷史學(xué)家利亞姆·J·利伯德和記者薩特南·桑赫拉的客座文章。萊斯特將調(diào)查結(jié)果描述為一個“令人鼓舞的跡象”,表明公眾對英國的過去越來越有洞察力。
“It shows an awareness that history is complicated, that Britons have done both admirable things and deplorable things in the past, and we need to break down history into the kinds of things that we see as sources of pride and those which we need to move beyond.”
“這表明人們意識到歷史是復(fù)雜的,英國人在過去做過令人欽佩的事情,也做過令人遺憾的事情,我們需要把歷史分解成我們認為值得驕傲的事情和我們需要超越的事情?!?/b>
“這表明人們意識到歷史是復(fù)雜的,英國人在過去做過令人欽佩的事情,也做過令人遺憾的事情,我們需要把歷史分解成我們認為值得驕傲的事情和我們需要超越的事情?!?/b>
He credits this shift in public consciousness to the Black Lives Matter movement and Britain’s changing demographics.
他將公眾意識的轉(zhuǎn)變歸功于“黑命貴”運動和英國人口結(jié)構(gòu)的變化。
他將公眾意識的轉(zhuǎn)變歸功于“黑命貴”運動和英國人口結(jié)構(gòu)的變化。
The demonstrations that erupted in the US in 2020 after a white police officer killed George Floyd were a catalyst for the largest wave of anti-racism protests in British history, taking place in more than 260 towns and cities that summer.
2020年,一名白人警察殺害喬治·弗洛伊德后,美國爆發(fā)了示威活動,引發(fā)了英國歷史上最大規(guī)模的反種族主義抗議浪潮,那年夏天在260多個城鎮(zhèn)發(fā)生。
2020年,一名白人警察殺害喬治·弗洛伊德后,美國爆發(fā)了示威活動,引發(fā)了英國歷史上最大規(guī)模的反種族主義抗議浪潮,那年夏天在260多個城鎮(zhèn)發(fā)生。
Statues of slave traders, such as Edward Colston’s in Bristol, were toppled, streets renamed, and venerable British institutions such as the Bank of England were forced to reckon with their ties to the slave trade.
像布里斯托爾的愛德華·科爾斯頓這樣的奴隸販子的雕像被推倒,街道被重新命名,英格蘭銀行等可敬的英國機構(gòu)被迫考慮與奴隸貿(mào)易的關(guān)系。
像布里斯托爾的愛德華·科爾斯頓這樣的奴隸販子的雕像被推倒,街道被重新命名,英格蘭銀行等可敬的英國機構(gòu)被迫考慮與奴隸貿(mào)易的關(guān)系。
“Black Lives Matter helped to crystallise the issue of slavery, antislavery, and ongoing racism in British society,” said Lester.
萊斯特說:“‘黑命貴’有助于將奴隸制、反奴隸制和英國社會中持續(xù)存在的種族主義問題具體化?!?/b>
萊斯特說:“‘黑命貴’有助于將奴隸制、反奴隸制和英國社會中持續(xù)存在的種族主義問題具體化?!?/b>
“There is still pride, virtually unchanged since the last survey, in artistic and cultural achievement, and in sporting achievements. And what that suggests to me is discernment about how we look back on our past; that we’re choosing Shakespeare over invasion, exploitation and occupation.”
“自上次調(diào)查以來,在藝術(shù)和文化成就以及體育成就方面,人們?nèi)匀桓械阶院?。這對我來說是一種洞察力——關(guān)于我們?nèi)绾位仡櫸覀兊倪^去;我們選擇莎士比亞而不是侵略、剝削和占領(lǐng)?!?/b>
“自上次調(diào)查以來,在藝術(shù)和文化成就以及體育成就方面,人們?nèi)匀桓械阶院?。這對我來說是一種洞察力——關(guān)于我們?nèi)绾位仡櫸覀兊倪^去;我們選擇莎士比亞而不是侵略、剝削和占領(lǐng)?!?/b>
Lester, the editor of the new book The Truth About Empire: Real Histories of British Colonialism, believes some of this trend is also down to the UK becoming more ethnically diverse since the last survey. Those who are descendants of people who were enslaved or colonised by Britain may have a different relationship to its past than many other British people.
萊斯特是新書《帝國的真相:英國殖民主義的真實歷史》的編輯,他認為,這種趨勢的部分原因還在于,自上次調(diào)查以來,英國變得更加種族多樣化。那些被英國奴役或殖民的人的后代可能與許多其他英國人有著不同的過去關(guān)系。
萊斯特是新書《帝國的真相:英國殖民主義的真實歷史》的編輯,他認為,這種趨勢的部分原因還在于,自上次調(diào)查以來,英國變得更加種族多樣化。那些被英國奴役或殖民的人的后代可能與許多其他英國人有著不同的過去關(guān)系。
Others have suggested that the decline in the number of people alive today who lived through or fought in the second world war may have also contributed to the drop in pride in Britain’s past.
還有人認為,經(jīng)歷過二戰(zhàn)或參加過二戰(zhàn)的人越來越少,這可能也是英國人對過去的自豪感下降的原因之一。
還有人認為,經(jīng)歷過二戰(zhàn)或參加過二戰(zhàn)的人越來越少,這可能也是英國人對過去的自豪感下降的原因之一。
But Lester believes this would have had a minimal impact, as the survey show a decline across age demographics and a broader shift in public consciousness, “thanks, in no small part, to the activism of Black Lives Matter and others who keep drawing our attention to the complexities of the past”.
但萊斯特認為,這只會產(chǎn)生很小的影響,因為調(diào)查顯示,各個年齡段的人口統(tǒng)計數(shù)據(jù)都在下降,公眾意識也在發(fā)生更廣泛的轉(zhuǎn)變,“這在很大程度上要歸功于‘黑命貴’運動的積極行動,以及其他一直讓我們關(guān)注過去的復(fù)雜性的人”。
但萊斯特認為,這只會產(chǎn)生很小的影響,因為調(diào)查顯示,各個年齡段的人口統(tǒng)計數(shù)據(jù)都在下降,公眾意識也在發(fā)生更廣泛的轉(zhuǎn)變,“這在很大程度上要歸功于‘黑命貴’運動的積極行動,以及其他一直讓我們關(guān)注過去的復(fù)雜性的人”。
The Black Lives Matter movement was met by a ferocious response from the right, who attacked protesters and historians alike for interrogating Britain’s imperial past. Lester said: “Sathnam Sanghera wrote the foreword for The Truth About Empire, in which he talks about how unacceptable it is that we’ve reached this stage of fervent denialism about the past, and such a fervour about Britishness and patriotism, that historians just doing their job are being called woke and attacked.”
“黑命貴”運動遭到了右翼的激烈回應(yīng),他們攻擊抗議者和歷史學(xué)家質(zhì)疑英國帝國的過去。萊斯特說:“薩特南·桑赫拉為《帝國的真相》寫了前言,他在前言中談到,我們已經(jīng)到了狂熱否認過去的階段,對英國人和愛國主義如此狂熱,以至于歷史學(xué)家只是在做他們的工作,卻被稱為覺醒和攻擊,這是多么不可接受?!?/b>
“黑命貴”運動遭到了右翼的激烈回應(yīng),他們攻擊抗議者和歷史學(xué)家質(zhì)疑英國帝國的過去。萊斯特說:“薩特南·桑赫拉為《帝國的真相》寫了前言,他在前言中談到,我們已經(jīng)到了狂熱否認過去的階段,對英國人和愛國主義如此狂熱,以至于歷史學(xué)家只是在做他們的工作,卻被稱為覺醒和攻擊,這是多么不可接受?!?/b>
The historian David Olusoga had to employ a bodyguard at some speaking events; Prof Corinne Fowler, who co-authored a report for the National Trust in 2019, was often forced to call police for protection, and Sanghera stopped doing public events with adults due to the severity of the abuse he received on a regular basis.
歷史學(xué)家大衛(wèi)·奧盧索加不得不在一些演講活動中雇傭保鏢;科琳·福勒教授是2019年國民信托基金會的一份報告的合著者,他經(jīng)常被迫打電話給警察尋求保護,桑赫拉也因為經(jīng)常受到嚴重的辱罵而不再和成年人一起參加公共活動。
歷史學(xué)家大衛(wèi)·奧盧索加不得不在一些演講活動中雇傭保鏢;科琳·福勒教授是2019年國民信托基金會的一份報告的合著者,他經(jīng)常被迫打電話給警察尋求保護,桑赫拉也因為經(jīng)常受到嚴重的辱罵而不再和成年人一起參加公共活動。
The survey also showed a decline in the proportion of people who believed that Britain was better than most other countries, or that people should support their country even if it was in the wrong.
調(diào)查還顯示,認為英國比大多數(shù)其他國家好,或者認為即使自己的國家做錯了,人們也應(yīng)該支持它的人的比例有所下降。
調(diào)查還顯示,認為英國比大多數(shù)其他國家好,或者認為即使自己的國家做錯了,人們也應(yīng)該支持它的人的比例有所下降。
People were also less likely to express pride in Britain’s democracy, its economic achievements and its political influence in the world.
人們也不太可能對英國的民主、經(jīng)濟成就和在世界上的政治影響力表示自豪。
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人們也不太可能對英國的民主、經(jīng)濟成就和在世界上的政治影響力表示自豪。
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While the report authors note these survey results have happened despite Brexit and the toxic debates around immigration, Lester suggested they might be a reaction to it.
盡管報告作者指出,盡管英國脫歐和圍繞移民的激烈辯論仍出現(xiàn)了這些調(diào)查結(jié)果,但萊斯特認為,這可能是對脫歐的一種反應(yīng)。
盡管報告作者指出,盡管英國脫歐和圍繞移民的激烈辯論仍出現(xiàn)了這些調(diào)查結(jié)果,但萊斯特認為,這可能是對脫歐的一種反應(yīng)。
“Pride in the British political system and pride in the British economy have both taken a big hit. I suspect that’s because of disillusionment directly as a result of Brexit,” he said.
“對英國政治體系的自豪感和對英國經(jīng)濟的自豪感都受到了重創(chuàng)。我懷疑這是因為英國脫歐直接導(dǎo)致的幻滅感,”他說。
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“對英國政治體系的自豪感和對英國經(jīng)濟的自豪感都受到了重創(chuàng)。我懷疑這是因為英國脫歐直接導(dǎo)致的幻滅感,”他說。
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“People have simply had enough of what Brexit has done to Britishness, to the identity of Britishness and to the reputation of Britain overseas, and they’ve had enough of the hatred and the bile being directed towards people seeking asylum.”
“人們已經(jīng)受夠了脫歐對英國特性、英國身份的認同和英國在海外的聲譽所造成的影響,他們已經(jīng)受夠了針對尋求庇護者的仇恨和憤怒?!?br />
“人們已經(jīng)受夠了脫歐對英國特性、英國身份的認同和英國在海外的聲譽所造成的影響,他們已經(jīng)受夠了針對尋求庇護者的仇恨和憤怒?!?br />
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I wouldn't mind if this were actually what was happening.
The trouble is, it's not. The tubthumping "aren't we the greatest" attitude hasn't been displaced by a more complex look at our history, it's been replaced by a discourse that is just as simplistic and one-sided - it's just negative rather than positive.
I've had multiple conversations on this subreddit with people who genuinely believe that Britain invented the slave trade. That the British Empire was some unique evil in history, with no other nation even considering actions as barbaric as ours. And who refuse to acknowledge any of the positive things that we may also have done (such as the West Africa Squadron, or defeating the Nazis). You get the impression that these people genuinely believe that everyone was peaceful and friendly until the British turned up and started murdering people.
And I would argue that such a negative perspective isn't just incredibly historically inaccurate, it's just led to an incredible amount of self-loathing. And that's simply not healthy.
如果真的是這樣,我也不介意。
問題是,事實并非如此。“我們不是最偉大的嗎?”這種傲慢的心態(tài)并沒有被更復(fù)雜地看待我們的歷史所取代,而是被一種同樣簡單和片面的話語所取代——它只是消極的,而不是積極的。
我在紅迪上和那些真正相信英國發(fā)明了奴隸貿(mào)易的人進行了多次對話。他們認為大英帝國是歷史上獨一無二的邪惡,沒有哪個國家會像我們這樣野蠻。他們拒絕承認我們也可能做過的任何積極的事情(比如西非中隊,或者打敗納粹)。你會覺得這些人真的相信每個人都是和平友好的,直到英國人出現(xiàn)并開始殺人。
我認為,這種消極的觀點不僅是歷史上非常不準確的,而且還導(dǎo)致了令人難以置信的自我厭惡。這是不健康的。
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Without pride in the history, accomplishments, values and historical institutions of your nation then what kind of unity is there? Why should people in a welfare state agree to pay to help others in that state? Without that sense of shared identity who cares about those people? An if attacked by a hostile state, why should you care? Why defend a state you have no pride in and people you don't feel any sense of shared identity with?
Small wonder the Russians and Chinese are pushing very hard on this throughout their social media efforts at destabilizing the West.
沒有對自己國家的歷史、成就、價值觀和歷史制度的自豪感,那還有什么團結(jié)呢?福利國家的人為什么要同意花錢幫助其他人呢?沒有這種共同的認同感,誰會關(guān)心那些人呢?如果被敵國攻擊,你又何必在意呢?為什么要捍衛(wèi)一個你不為之驕傲的國家,為什么要捍衛(wèi)那些你沒有任何共同認同感的人?
難怪俄羅斯人和中國人正在通過社交媒體努力推動這一點,以破壞西方的穩(wěn)定。
Ancient history is, well ancient history. I’m not going to feel bad for the deeds my (?) ancestors committed. Get fucked.
古代史就是古代史。我不會為我(?)的祖先所做的事感到把不舒服的。qnmd。
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Nobody has said you should.
沒人說你應(yīng)該。
It's not about feeling bad. It's about recognising our history and how we should learn from it.
There are many who say we should go back to our old values, they use our past as a model for all that is good. That's where it becomes dangerous.
這不是關(guān)于感覺不舒服。而是要認識到我們的歷史,以及我們應(yīng)該如何從中吸取教訓(xùn)。
有很多人說我們應(yīng)該回到我們的舊價值觀,他們把我們的過去作為一切美好事物的榜樣。這就是危險所在。
The right-wing nationalism that exploded during Brexit was frightening to see and it's still echoing around the country today.
It's not "remember we did this so you're made to feel bad", it's "remember we did this so we don't fucking do it again".
在英國脫歐期間爆發(fā)的右翼民族主義令人恐懼,如今仍在全國各地回響。
這不是“記住我們做過這件事,這樣你就會感覺不舒服”,而是“記住我們做過這件事,這樣我們就不會再犯了”。
It's not about feeling bad about it it's about understanding how it happened, why it happened, and, where applicable, the way it's legacy continues to shape things today.
More importantly it's about not repeating the mistakes.
The UK right now is assisting in two GENO....s by its allies (Israel and Saudi Arabia). This is not the UK being scumbags in the past, this is the UK being scumbags now.
這并不是說要為此感到難過,而是要理解它是如何發(fā)生的,為什么會發(fā)生,以及在適用的情況下,它的遺產(chǎn)如何繼續(xù)塑造今天的世界。
更重要的是不要重蹈覆轍。
英國現(xiàn)在正在協(xié)助其盟友(以色列和沙特阿拉伯)進行兩次種族滅絕。這不是英國過去的卑鄙行為,這是英國今天的卑鄙行為。
History is complex, millions of people living, trading, fighting, stealing things and people for hundreds of years. Really can't be distilled into a few sentences of right and wrong, good and evil.
歷史是復(fù)雜的,數(shù)以百萬計的人生活、交易、戰(zhàn)斗、偷竊物品和人長達千百年。真的不能提煉成幾句對與錯,善與惡。
Yup. Historians can write books hundreds of pages long on one tiny part of history, yet the general public and media seem to think it can be done in a few hundred words.
In reality, history is so complex and with so many viewpoints, that one historian's view can be completely different from the next.
是的。歷史學(xué)家可以就歷史的一小部分寫出數(shù)百頁的書,而公眾和媒體似乎認為幾百字就能寫完。
事實上,歷史是如此復(fù)雜,有如此多的觀點,以至于一個歷史學(xué)家的觀點可能與另一個歷史學(xué)家的觀點完全不同。
One problem with history is people's inability to look at it from different viewpoints. Why we believe something is right or wrong was shaped in the past so to judge people of a different era based on our own modern morality is wrong because normalcy was different then. For example people mainly think slavery is bad because the British decided it was bad and enforced a ban, before that slavery was just normalcy. People are also massive hypocrites, they'll complain about a long gone empire having slavery but the same people happily support modern day slavery and forced labour. Most big sporting events are really just adverts for companies that use modern day slavery, at least in history people were more honest about their arseholery.
歷史的一個問題在于人們無法從不同的角度看待它。我們對對錯的判斷是在過去形成的,所以根據(jù)我們自己的現(xiàn)代道德來判斷不同時代的人是錯誤的,因為標準是不同的。例如,人們主要認為奴隸制是不好的,因為英國人今天認為它是不好的,并實施了禁令,但在此之前,奴隸制就是正常的。人們也是巨大的偽君子,他們會抱怨一個早已不復(fù)存在的帝國有奴隸制,但同樣的人缺樂于支持現(xiàn)代奴隸制和強迫勞動。大多數(shù)大型體育賽事實際上只是為那些使用現(xiàn)代奴隸制的公司做廣告,至少在歷史上,人們對自己的惡行更誠實。
If you look at the survey comparing 2003 to 2013, everything goes up, aside from economic achievements. Economic achievements likely being heavily influenced by the global recession still being in the memory of people. 2013 is one year after the London Olympics which had a fairly big impact on a number of people. While you might think that just equates to sport, I'd argue it goes beyond that based on the nostalgia many people have for the opening ceremony.
However, from 2013 to 2023, history goes down alongside a number of other things, including democracy and political influence. So, while I don't doubt some of the arguments around BLM and the ethnic makeup of the country, is some of it not just down to people generally being quite sour about the state of the UK in 2023 and the fact history can often get associated with things like government? You'll tend to find most people don't actually think about these things regarding empire and the British history.
如果你看一下2003年和2013年的調(diào)查,除了經(jīng)濟成就之外,一切都在上升。經(jīng)濟成就很可能受到全球經(jīng)濟衰退的嚴重影響,人們?nèi)匀挥洃洩q新。2013年是倫敦奧運會之后的一年,倫敦奧運會對許多人產(chǎn)生了相當大的影響。雖然你可能認為這只是體育運動,但我認為,基于許多人對開幕式的懷舊之情,這不僅僅是體育運動。
然而,從2013年到2023年,包括民主和政治影響力在內(nèi)的許多其他事情都在歷史上發(fā)生了變化。所以,雖然我不懷疑關(guān)于“黑命貴”和國家種族構(gòu)成的一些爭論,但其中一些不僅僅是因為人們普遍對2023年的英國狀態(tài)感到不滿,而且歷史經(jīng)常與政府等事情聯(lián)系在一起?你會發(fā)現(xiàn)大多數(shù)人實際上并沒有考慮到帝國和英國歷史。
I'm 32, not proud to be British. I do appreciate that in many ways Britain is a great place to live and is much more progressive than many parts of the world buuuuuuut there are serious problems in this country NOW, forget the past. Sure we should learn from our past and recognise how some things good or bad affect l lives today but surely a country should be judged by it's residents and outsiders on how it is here and now
我32歲了,不為自己是英國人而驕傲。我很欣賞英國在很多方面都是一個適合生活的好地方,比世界上許多地方都要進步得多,但是這個國家現(xiàn)在存在著嚴重的問題,忘記過去吧。當然,我們應(yīng)該從過去吸取教訓(xùn),認識到一些好的或壞的事情是如何影響我們今天的生活的,但當然,一個國家應(yīng)該由它的居民和局外人來判斷它現(xiàn)在的情況
The thing is if the British should look back at its history with shame, then so should everybody else? It only seems to be Europeans being told they have nothing to be proud of and their history is defined be conquest and colonialism (and in some cases that we literally need to apologise and pay reparations...).
But then who can be proud of their history? All the pre-Spanish, South American civilizations practiced slavery, violent conquestz sometimes ritual human sacrifices; every single major African power practiced slavery and violent conquest; the Arab empires did violent conquest and slavery; Ottomans, the South Asian empires...
Wherever you look it's the same story: conquest and slavery. The Europeans were no different. The scale was larger but does anyone seriously believe that if the African or South American civilisations had developed advanced military technology first, that they wouldn't themselves have conquered distant lands? They had conquered nearby lands so the only difference is the mileage.
問題是,如果英國人應(yīng)該帶著羞愧回顧自己的歷史,那么其他人也應(yīng)該如此嗎?似乎只有歐洲人被告知他們沒有什么值得驕傲的,他們的歷史被定義為征服和殖民主義(在某些情況下,我們真的需要道歉和支付賠款……)
但誰能為自己的歷史感到驕傲呢?西班牙之前的所有南美文明都實行奴隸制和暴力征服,有時還舉行活人祭祀儀式;每一個非洲大國都實行奴隸制和暴力征服;阿拉伯帝國進行暴力征服和奴役;奧斯曼帝國、南亞帝國……
無論你往哪里看,都是同一個故事:征服和奴役。歐洲人也不例外。規(guī)模更大,但真的有人相信,如果非洲或南美文明先發(fā)展出先進的軍事技術(shù),他們自己就不會征服遙遠的土地嗎?他們已經(jīng)征服了附近的土地,所以唯一的區(qū)別是距離。